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ATCpro Build 21

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Jsabot View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jsabot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2018 at 3:12am
STARS is what ATCPro is simulating, it is what is used in almost every major TRACON in the US. It looks like this: 





ARTCC's use a completely different system. It's called ERAM. It looks like this:

Borrowed from this cool article:


There is also a highly realistic program called vERAM that we use to control on vatsim. theres plenty of videos of a vatsim controller on twitch using it. it's based heavily on typing commands.

If you want to see more, you can call and get a tour of an ARTCC, just google the location of one of them and call em up. You may not live near one of them though, they are usually farther away from you than say, a TRACON would be.



Edited by Jsabot - 29 Dec 2018 at 3:18am
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NyyDave View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NyyDave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jan 2019 at 3:35pm
Wow time flies. Just a short 2 years ago I was beta testing updates and here we are really 3 years later with nothing but $60 holes in our pockets and broken product.

You tried hard early on. It didn't work. I'll keep checking here like once a month but the window on this one is over.
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atcitizen View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote atcitizen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2019 at 2:17am
Its such a disappointment, especially because there are so many loyal and enthusiastic customers waiting. 
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bill3810 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote bill3810 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2019 at 4:33am
Or another option in the meantime:

As complaints and constant questions as to when the next release will be available have generated zero results.....I have opted to try and make my experience with the current version as enjoyable as it can be.

For the most part I have enjoyable sessions every time and I use it 3-5 times weekly a minimum of 1 hour each day.  

Here are some things that I do to improve the experience:

GA traffic can be a pain, so I generally just either turn it off or turn it down a bit.  Tom gave us some updated GA traffic files and I have been using those with little issues in the areas that I have been working.  Again I turn them down to around 50% or less depending on the time i control.

I enjoy working the feeders and final and even though final in ATL can be very tricky when it's busy I have found that with some crafty vectoring I can work an entire session (1 hour and not get any CA's) with other runways.  Feels a bit more like work than enjoyment after 1 hour but it's similar to the workload of the real controllers so it's challenging for sure.

If you don't work ATL much i'm sure that in the RW the controllers are coordinating altitudes with the other controllers so there are no conflicts when joining the localizer.  Sometimes I have to take aircraft out below the O sectors arriving aircraft at 5000 just to keep them from conflicting.  If I choose to turn them in early I give them join the localizer only to ensure they don't descend until they are stabilized on the localizer and thus I can vector them in right next to other aircraft without a conflict, just studying the sector and how things flow will help you figure that out. 

One bug I noticed is that you need to give them cleared approach just as soon as they are established on the LOC or sometimes they turn away and fly off the localizer, quick double click with the center mouse button and they are in the penalty box for the rest of the session.
Or cancel approach clearance and re-clear if there is no other traffic around.

Joining a session:  When I join I always de-select all the positions.  I think TOM has said don't do this but I see really no negative impact and I could care less about the career until it's working properly.

Then once i'm in the session any ridiculous conflicts or rogue aircraft in the game I put in the penalty box with the center mouse double click until all stupidity is removed.  THEN I sign on and go about enjoying my session. 

Modifying the DB:  If you are finding some weird things happening in sectors like constant requests for point outs or aircraft climbing into your sector a quick look at the DB and you can find issues with altitude constraints and fix those and then it works beautifully.  Lots of guys have done that and I thank them for helping me.

One example is the DIRTY2 in ATL.  I have created ALT restrictions at certain fixes and once given the descend via they will start from 14,000 on entry to my sector and be abeam the approach path at 5000 and 180 knots on their own, slowing at each speed constraint I have set.  A little tweaking of the DB is all it took.  Takes some of the work and challenge away but after you have talked non stop for 1 hour descend via is a nice pet to have.

I was getting a lot of conflicts in MIA from departures and also from constant point outs, again a simple modification to altitude constraints on the HITAG and HILEY and it's smooth sailing.

Find Good Time Windows:  When you find a window with minimal hiccups then remember it and keep a list and work those windows.  Also I haven't tried this yet but each facility has a GA Schedule.  Make a copy of it and put it in a safe place and you can edit that schedule.  If you notice a few GA flights that are messed up every time, note the flight and time and go in the Schedule and delete that flight.  As I said I haven't tried it but again, just save your original and give it a go.  You will need SQLite for that.

Standing on the shoulders of others who have figured all of this out before me I have learned my way around the DB and it's quite enjoyable.  I've even developed a program to sort and search the DB and make edits very quickly without the need of SQlite.  

Speaking of that I've also written a program in which I can create custom schedules about as fast as you can copy and paste from Flight Aware which gives you the most current schedule data in the Sim.  There are some brief explanations on this in the forums and I would also be happy to help anyone out that's interested in learning.

Another thing I have started to do is learn each sector in each Facility Starting with MIA I start with the Feeders and Finals then the departures then start working the satellite sectors.  This gets me familiar with the entire facility AND helps me identify issues that I can tweak in the DB.  It will take a long time to get through each facility doing it this way and doing it until you are proficient so that also helps to stretch out the enjoyment.

Again these are just some things I have done to increase the enjoyment while waiting for the new release, not for everyone but thought I would put it out there as another option.


Edited by bill3810 - 03 Jan 2019 at 4:38am
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brodie4598 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brodie4598 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2019 at 8:09am
I think the reason people are so upset (or me at least) is how close this one came before being abandoned. I paid for another ATC sim a few months ago - it was terrible and I uninstalled it within an hour. I didn't give it a second thought. I didn't visit the forums every day hoping for a fix, I just completely forgot about it because it was a long way from being good. 

This sim, on the other hand, is seriously 95% to being perfect and better than anything ever released before. The problem is that the remaining 5% are things that make it unplayable (to me, at least). 

I credit you, Bill, for having to come up with all of those workarounds to enjoy it but I can't suspend so many aspects of the sim in order to force myself to have fun. I uninstalled ATCPro more than a year ago and just check this forum damn near every day. 

Someone should take this project over. If he's done developing it then whatever - we cant force him back into it, but please don't let this die. I would gladly pay for it again from another developer if these things actually got fixed. 
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bill3810 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bill3810 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2019 at 11:12am
I can understand that, but I don’t see anywhere in the forums where he’s stated development is finished... if he has point me to it.

As I understand it they are a two man team and there’s only 1 Dev really.

I would have to say that it would be nice to get a monthly update even if it’s not much more than “progress continues”.

However on the flip side there is no way to get around chatter and complaints in the forumn you will always be damnded if you do and damned if you don’t. Flag Mountain is no the only company that doesn’t touch base on a regular basis maybe that’s just their choice but until you have heard the words development is finished I wouldn’t give up.

Plus if it’s going to take 6 more months it will be 6 more months whether you know ahead of time or not.

Lastly it’s true it is the best ATC Simulation ever made hands down and as I said earlier I’ve been able to make the most of it I with little tweaks.

Here’s hoping we will see 21 in 19.

Cheers
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brodie4598 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2019 at 11:48am
He hasn't but actions speak more than words. Or inaction in this case. It was the beginning of September that they announced the explanation of the delay until that point and I was the first one to forgive the delay in light of the hardships that they were having. Tom said they hoped to have it out at the end of September. That's been 5 months ago now without a substantive update.

What's more flabbergasting is this post was started almost exactly a year ago and the first sentence was, "ATCpro Build #21 has been completed, and is now in beta testing.

I understand software development. I started an aviation software company myself and I now work for a software company that makes about a billion a year on dozens and dozens of applications. Software always is a bit buggy and is always later than anticipated. Of if it's released on time it's just extra buggy :)

Watching this go down it seems pretty clear there's zero interest from the dev (for whatever reason). AND the longer it goes the harder it gets because you start forgetting the code that you've written (trust me I sure know about that...)

My fingers are crossed and will stay that way but my expectations are zero. 

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Stooge View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stooge Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2019 at 4:51pm
Originally posted by brodie4598 brodie4598 wrote:

What's more flabbergasting is this post was started almost exactly a year ago and the first sentence was, "ATCpro Build #21 has been completed, and is now in beta testing.



If I recall correctly there are some who were in the beta test, and I assume still are. Which raises the question, why not open it to all. 

I'm honestly not sure it matters, to be honest. I've not played in so long I'd have to start over and re-learn it all again. The whole thing is rather sad, it had a ton of potential.
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Ketil64 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ketil64 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan 2019 at 6:08pm
yeah, it died rather quickly

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tom@FlagMountain Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jan 2019 at 3:45pm
I am really at a loss as to how to respond to the posts in this thread.  You guys are frustrated, but STAND IN LINE.  As I said in previous posts, Other Tom's wife was diagnosed with breast cancer, and that took 9 months to work through.  Prognosis is now good, but the distraction is obvious, or should be.  At the moment, Tom has damaged a couple of the vertebrae in his back, and is facing surgery.  His mobility is impaired, and he cannot sit at a desk chair for very long.  Last report I had from him was that they were going to try some new nerve treatment.  No results yet.  Would I like to have had R21 out six months ago - Damn Straight.  Can I do anything about it - nope.  Doesn't make sense for me to try to pick up Other Tom's portion of the code, but if I had known then what I know now, would have started that process.  At this point, just gotta wait a bit longer.  Not the answer you (or I) want, but it's the only one I have at the moment. 

Regards

Tom
Tom Murdock
Flag Mountain Software
ATCpro Project Team
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